800MHz 4G broadband potential for Freeview interference - new map

Published on 27th January 2013 at 12:56 by Brian Butterworth on UK Free TV

To assist with working out where there will be problems when the 4G mobile broadband services launch, I have created a map showing the transmitter areas where the multiplexes will be using the higher end of the transmission range, channels C52 to C60.

If you are using transmitter with these allocations, it is more likely that you will need to fit a filter. If you have your area in an area with allocations outside this range, it is less likely.

However - the problems will only occur when 4G 800MHz services start, and then only if you are close to a mast. See  How do I know if the 4G broadband will overload my Freeview?. Being close to a TV transmitter may help. Click on the map to see the full interactive version.

   number of multiplexes in C52-C60 range when 4G 800MHz services start  Retune only

When the 4G action is complete, we will have a clearer idea of the locations that will require a filter fitting.

Your comments are always welcome. Please use the form below to add your thoughts or questions to this page. We will get back to you as soon as we can.

Jon
Sunday 27 January 2013 6:27PM

I take it green is good red is bad?
What do all the diffrent numbers represent?
Can't see a key.

woodface
Sunday 27 January 2013 9:41PM

Yep, green is good red is bad.

Click and zoom in to the map, and see Red scores 5 and you'll likely be filtered and/or troubled. Orange scores 4 = better odds, 3 is amber, 2 is Yellow. Green scores 1 or zero, you can breathe easy.

Basically, if you can wave at some main masts like Winter Hill through the window you're screwed.

<waves through window at lights of Winter Hill...>

Dave Lindsay
Sunday 27 January 2013 9:53PM

woodface: The stronger the TV signal the less prone to interference it will be from the same level 4G 800MHz signal. This is because the TV signal will be "louder".

woodface
Sunday 27 January 2013 9:58PM

Course, you'll still need a 4G phone mast somewhere about the direction your rooftop aerial points.

Though I've a hunch I'll be as lucky with that as I am with the clump of trees (complete with preservation order) at 28 degrees East, precisely blocking UK satellite signals for most of the year.

ian from notts
Monday 28 January 2013 8:07AM Nottingham

the numbers tell you how many mux's the transmitter will have affected and thus the colour will suit.
i take it we will need to know which mobile masts will be using the c61 to c69 frequencys before we know if sites like all of winter hill will be affected ? like the map is showing?

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Briantist
Monday 28 January 2013 8:40AM

ian from notts: I tried to make this all clear in the  How do I know if the 4G broadband will overload my Freeview? | 4G mobile | ukfree.tv - 10 years of independent, free digital TV advice article, there are two ways you can be effected.

1. "direct" interference - which is a mast transmitting on a signal on a frequency near to one you want for Freeview; and

2. "indirect" interference - which is an overload condition and happens regardless of the frequency you are going for.

The masts will all be using C61 to C64 for downlinks, the phones will be using C66-C69 for uplinks. C65 will be held clear.

The six winning operators will get 5MHz each.

Until we know who wins which 5MHz, and then where and when they deploy their base stations, will we know better who might be effected.

However, until then, the above maps is the best guide as to the "general areas" where there might be issues.

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Stuart Owens
Tuesday 29 January 2013 3:18PM Wrexham

I thought that 61-68 where going to be used for 4G? What's going to be on those frequencies now?

I thought that was why Moel-Y-Parc's D3&4 multiplex was moved to 39 from 49 to enable Winter Hill's BBCA and ARQA multiplexes to be moved from 62 and 61 to 50 and 49 respectively on 10th April to avoid what I thought were going to be 4G frequencies on 61 and 62?

Have I got confused or is 61-68 now going to be used for something else?

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KMJ,Derby
Tuesday 29 January 2013 5:45PM

Stuart Owens: You were correct with your first understanding of the situation regarding M-Y-P and Winter Hill frequency changes. Once the 4G services are up and running C61 to C64 will be used for signals coming from the 4G masts, C66 to C69 for signals from mobile handsets to the mast.

Stuart Owens
Tuesday 29 January 2013 6:22PM Wrexham

KMJ,Derby: So is 52-60 also being used for 4G as well as for Freeview?
Or is it a case that even a 4G signal on 52 can interfere somewhat with a Freeview signal as far away as 61 on the frequency scale?

Also, are TV/Radio masts ever used for mobile phone communications (3G or 4G)? If not, then why as with their height it would make sense for better signal and less prone to obstructions.

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KMJ,Derby
Tuesday 29 January 2013 8:23PM

Stuart Owens: C52 to C60 at present is used only for Freeview. However this frequency range is seen as being possibly at risk of interference from 4G signals using the C61 to C69 range. C60 being the most likely frequency to be affected (and C52 least likely), but this is particularly in areas where there is a strong 4G signal and a weak Freeview signal, where amplification is used and is more likely to be a problem if the 4G signal is coming from the same direction as a weak Freeview signal, where the Freeview signal is vertically polarised and where poor quality coax is used for the downlead or fly leads. The frequency range C49 to C60 could possibly be cleared in the future for 4G/5G use, in which case Freeview would move to lower frequencies and a new range of frequencies would then be potentially at risk from interference, chiefly C39 to C48. Regarding your last point, there are many radio and TV masts that also carry mobile phone antennae. Where masts are shared the likelyhood is that interference will be less of a problem as the Freeview signal would normally be stronger than the 4G signal in the target area.

Briantist
Wednesday 30 January 2013 7:19AM

Stuart Owens: Just to add to the above, the issue is also that digital TV receivers with superheterodyne circuits suffer from the N+9 problem - there is a distinct interfere problem nine 8MHz channels away - so C52, C53, C54 and C55 are *MORE* likely to have problems.

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Briantist
Wednesday 30 January 2013 7:21AM

TV masts are not normally used for 2G/3G services, as they are not really in suitable locations. Here's the Brighton and Hove comparison of sites as an example:

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Briantist
Wednesday 30 January 2013 8:19AM

ian from notts: Yes, you will need to know where the masts are.

But we won't know this until the capacity is won and the winners select their locations.

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Dave Randles
Wednesday 24 April 2013 11:44PM

My partner today received a postcard from Digital Mobile Spectrum Limited advising her that our Freeview TV service may soon be subjected to 4G interference.

I find it quite unacceptable that legitimate television viewers, who have paid for their licence fee in full, should be inconvenienced in this way. Surely both Ofcom and the BBC have a statutory duty to ensure that this part of the spectrum that is reserved for public broadcasting remains free from unwanted interference.

The recent spectrum auction raised a considerable amount of money that should be used to solve the problem without the need to install filters in millions of homes across the UK. Given the current advice about probable signal overloading at mastheads, the issue also raises huge safety concerns about potentially excessive power levels that are required to service the new 4G networks. Grateful if you could advise whether a full risk assessment has been conducted and, if so, where this can be viewed by members of the public.

Please can someone advise why contact was made with my partner who does not hold a tv licence and is ex-directory rather than the listed licence holder at my address.

Thank you

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ian from notts
Friday 26 April 2013 7:43AM Nottingham

Dave Randles- this is an independent site mate and does not hold the info for tv licencee holders,
as we speak (as such) areas of birmingham and london are being used as test areas for the introduction of 4G to see what levels of interference they have to deal with.
the sale of the spectrum included conditions on the phone companys to ensure tv viewing disruptions were dealt with, this includes the essential fitting of filters to block unwanted signals

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