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BBC/ITV Freesat - Spring 08

The BBC/ITV service will provide a high definition "guaranteed non-subscription" digital satellite service.

The BBC/ITV service will provide a high definition  guaranteed
Published on by on UK Free TV


We've been reporting about BBC Freesat since early 2006

The BBC's service, which is now set to launch in spring 2008, will provide a "guaranteed non-subscription" digital satellite service.

The boxes will provide a HDTV satellite version of the popular Freeview service, with a number of BBC, ITV channels in high definition plus all the existing services that the current Freesat service provides.

The BBC and ITV Freesat service will also provide an alternate (but compatible) electronic programme guide (EPG), and will provide interactive services.

Currently both Channel 4 and five have agreements with Sky which require their channels (with the exception of Film4) to require the use of a "Freesat From Sky" card. This means that you currently need to purchase a card from Sky Subscriber Services Ltd for 20 to watch Channel 4, five, Five US, Five Life and Sky Three.

Whilst this card is included as part of the 150 cost of Freesat From Sky, Sky have in the past invalidated the existing cards and demanded payment for a new one from Freesat users. Last time Sky did this the telephone number that was provided told customers that the must subscribe and mislead callers telling them no replacement cards were available!

The BBC/ITV service will have several potential uses:

  1. a box-swap replacement to upgrade an existing Freesat from Sky or Sky subscription box for a box with HDTV services;
  2. a box-swap replacement for a Sky+ box for a HDTV satellite personal video recorder;
  3. a multi-room installation with an existing dish fitted with a quad-LNB;
  4. connection to a Windows Vista Media Centre or Windows Home Server;
Mark Thompson (BBC Director-General) said "The BBC's objective in launching Freesat is to support Digital Switchover by providing another way for licence payers to receive digital television channels and radio services, subscription free from the BBC and ITV.

"Its primary purpose is to drive digital take-up in analogue homes, particularly in those areas which are out of digital terrestrial coverage. Freesat also offers a trusted free-to-view digital upgrade path that gives licence payers all the benefits of digital television (notably high definition capability) guaranteed free of subscription."

Michael Grade (ITV Executive Chairman) said "Freesat will build on the success of Freeview by offering viewers a simple and cost effective way of upgrading to digital TV. By filling in the current gaps in Freeview coverage, Freesat will ensure that a free-to-air, no strings attached option for accessing digital TV is available to the whole of the UK ahead of digital switchover. By offering HD capability we will future proof Freesat if, as expected, high definition television continues to capture the imagination of UK viewers."

What channels will be provided?

The current single-channel HDTV service for the BBC is only a test service. It seems reasonable that the BBC will provide the main channels in HD resolution. This will probably not extend to the BBC regional news services, and may not initially include the national variations in HD.

ITV1 is the only network of theirs with regional variations, so again a "Network" version of the channel will be provided in HD, with SDTV potentially regional adverts inserted. It seems reasonable that ITV2, ITV3, ITV4 and CITV will also broadcast in HD.

It seems that the other public service broadcasters, Channel 4, five and S4C will want to get on board. This will require E4, C4, More4, five, five Life and five US to change their broadcasts, or for the new BBC Freesat to simulcast these channels as HD.

Channel 4 told the Guardian that the channel "currently has exclusive [digital satellite] carriage deals in place with Sky Digital for the majority of its channels (other than for Film4, which is broadcast free-to-air). Under the Communications Act we would expect to become subject to obligations to ensure the availability of the core channel on all satellite platforms, which would require that Channel 4 was available on Freesat."

As for the other non-public service Freeview channels:
  1. Ftn, The Hits, TMF, UKTV Bright Ideas, UKTV History are locked into Sky subscription agreements, but obviously it would be to the benefit of Freesat if these channels could be made available to the extra 2.5 million homes.
  2. Sky Sports News is a subscription service on satellite and Sky Three would have to go free-to-air, which may happen to show Sky's benevolence.
  3. Sky News is broadcast free-to-air.






Your comments: most recent posts are at the bottom

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Your comments are always welcome. Please use the form below to add your thoughts or questions to this page. We will get back to you as soon as we can.

Briantist
Thursday 19 June 2008 10:51PM
Bob: I am sure ITV HD will end up as a proper channel by itself soon.
Alex Thomson
Sunday 29 June 2008 8:51PM Cromarty
My TV is not an HD one. Does this mean I can't upgrade from Sky to Freesat? Is Freesat only for HD channels?
Les Nicol
Monday 30 June 2008 12:32PM
Alex You will be able to upgrade OK. You simply won't get HD reception until such time as you upgrade your TV.
Les Nicol
Tuesday 1 July 2008 11:19AM
Humax Foxsat-HD latest update 1.00.10..................This update will improve lip-sync issue as well as screen ratio and picture formats plus others
Briantist
Tuesday 1 July 2008 11:32AM
Les Nicol: I noticed that came though this morning. Still no Wimbledon though...
Briantist
Tuesday 1 July 2008 12:42PM
Alex Thomson: You can watch the HD channels, just not in HD.
Les Nicol
Monday 7 July 2008 12:20PM
Lot of negative comments regarding the Humax Freesat box with many stating that the lip-sync issues are still posing a problem even after the recent update. Wimbeldon interviews badly affected.
Briantist
Monday 7 July 2008 12:25PM
Les Nicol: I can't say I have noticed any problems on my box...
Les Nicol
Monday 7 July 2008 12:50PM
Brian ---Check www.joinfreesat.co.uk
Briantist
Monday 7 July 2008 12:51PM
Les Nicol: I already read about it earlier.
Les Nicol
Monday 7 July 2008 1:01PM
Brian---Have just bought a Humax Foxsat box. As yet not connected as I am working on my dish set up and being held up by poor weather. As soon as, I will check my box and post results.
Briantist
Monday 7 July 2008 1:03PM
Les Nicol: Thanks. I'll be interested to hear if you have the problem too.
ric
Wednesday 9 July 2008 8:00PM
Hi, I have just connected up a Humax Foxsat HD unit and am very impressed. It also nicely fills the gap left by my broken (non subscription) digital sky box.

When using the 'I' button an information bar appears at the bottom of the TV screen,which along with the program info, shows two bars which indicate signal strength and signal quality.

When in Freesat mode both the bars indicate 100% across all channels, but when in non freesat STB mode they vary and can both drop down as low as 80% ? ,depending on which channel is being viewed. Both bars are still within the green area on the indicator bar.

Q . Is it worth tweaking the dish to even out the signal strength/quality differences which I presume are due to the programs coming from two different satellites - or am I wrong and this difference is because the freesat programs are affected less by all this bad weather.

I have a 3 or 4 year old 600mm oval shaped dish (unknown make) wired up with one uninterupted length of ct125 cabling from the LNB into the rear of the box.

Ric

Briantist
Wednesday 9 July 2008 8:12PM
ric: 80% in the quality bar is fine for me, it's probably when you are looking at channels that are on the Eurobird 1 satellite, which is at a slightly different position 28.5°E rather than 28.2°E - www.lyngsat.com link icon Eurobird 1 at 28.5°E - LyngSat - if the pictures remain stable, the dish is OK.
Les Nicol
Thursday 10 July 2008 1:17PM
Brian--- No immediate problems re: lip-sync with my Humax but will monitor this aspect particularly with live outside broadcast comment. Standard definition not up to my Manhattan though which I would say is as close to HD as one could get. I live in a rural are of Dumfries and Galloway and have opted for Satellite rather than what even with Freeview reception will be a limited service via a relay transmitter. My set up is a 1.25 meter dish driven by a 36 volt Jaeger motor and a backup static 60cm Triax both located in my back garden and self set up and installed using top end LNB's.


both dishes have twin cable to the respective receivers should I opt in the future for a PVR although I can record to the Manhattan's 160gb HDD meantime. May try the Humax on the motor dish (currently on the Triax) and compare standard picture quality between the larger and smaller dish reception.
Les Nicol
Thursday 10 July 2008 2:57PM
Brian -- Humax standard definition sees improved picture quality when set coupled to larger dish also able to add Hotbird channels when dish moved to 13degrees East.
Briantist
Thursday 10 July 2008 2:58PM
Les Nicol: You wouldn't expect that with digital reception.. it's all or nothing!
Les Nicol
Thursday 10 July 2008 7:40PM
Brian -- Hear what your saying, but there are several factors that determine eg;
signal strength and picture quality. Size does matter as far as the dish is concerned. As does the Low Noise Block Amplifiers rating in dealing with static signal noise suppression and finally the receivers build quality tuner range and software. A few years ago the Panasonic TU-DSB 50 was much sought after by ex pats in Spain, Portugal and the Canaries because of its build quality and its tuner range in determining the end result. So for me all or nothing simplifies the end result.
Briantist
Saturday 12 July 2008 3:40PM
Les Nicol: With digital, all that matters is if you can decode the bitstream. Either you can - perfect data - or you can't. I've written an article about it all. It still needs pictures, I'll post it asap.
Les Nicol
Thursday 17 July 2008 10:51AM
I see that it is projected that the Humax PVR will be in the shops for the Christmas season. It is also confirmed that the analogue component out as is with the current receiver will be dropped from the PVR.
Briantist
Thursday 17 July 2008 10:58AM
Les Nicol: Apparently.
Les Nicol
Friday 18 July 2008 9:13AM
Although the component out is being dropped from the Humax PVR it is reported that it will have a USB port that will allow archiving to an external HDD over and above the onboard HDD recording facility.
Briantist
Friday 18 July 2008 9:36AM
Les Nicol: Sounds sensible. I've never really understood why this wasn't standard on PVRs, it is hardly an expensive add on.

Tell you what I would REALLY like. A combined Freesat+ and Freeview+ box with say two tuners for each in it, with a SINGLE EPG. That would be amazing... you could get your HD from satellite and still have Dave and UKTV History. Having four tuners with automatic locating the "best" one (say, highest bitrate) would be good!
Les Nicol
Friday 18 July 2008 9:56AM
Brian, The Technomate 6900 PVR has two Sat Tuners plus a Freeview tuner. The problem is that although you can get the BBC HD channel which is listed in the channel selection software and their EPG it doesn't have "FreeSat" and that of course denies access as yet to ITV HD currently red button access.----------Pity!"
Briantist
Friday 18 July 2008 9:59AM
Les Nicol: Any such box really needs to be a fully integrated Freeview/Freesat box with an intelligent EPG to be a hit, I would have thought. Freesat is not just DVB-S/S2, it is the MHEG-5 and EPG too.
Les Nicol
Friday 18 July 2008 10:39AM
Brian. That's why it's a "Pity" that "FreeSat" hasn't been opened up to other manufacturers than a select few. Apart from Humax (with some historial pedigree), who are obviously "tooled up" both at the drawing board and the manufacturing end, Others equally capable seem to be "off the map" as far as "FreeSat" is concerned. So how about some competition here!
Briantist
Friday 18 July 2008 10:54AM
Les Nicol: There is to be a second and third wave of manufacturers over the next six months.
Les Nicol
Saturday 26 July 2008 10:51AM
Brian ----Uplinking arrangements re FreeSat's EPG. Where does Sky come into this? I perhaps mistakenly understood that the BBC/ITV and others had broken the link with SKY and were now contracting directly with ASTRA and EUTELSAT
Briantist
Saturday 26 July 2008 12:12PM
Les Nicol: The Sky EPG data is carried in the transport stream of all transponders that carry any channels that are carried at least one channel that appears in their EPG. This is necessary because the at least a days worth of EPG needs to be accessible whilst you are watching TV. On a Sky Digibox when you press the "TV GUIDE" button the box tunes to the "default transponder" so that the full EPG can be accesses to give the multiple-day listings. So, even when companies like the BBC and ITV uplink their own channels, they have to add in the Sky EPG data into the transport stream.

The Freesat EPG is carried in the same way as the Sky one, but is in a "different table". For both systems to EPG for the same channels, both EPGs have to be provided on the transponder.

This means that Sky can claim they need to roll out the channels slowly so they can "test" the Freesat data, but it is a bit of a bogus claim as it well within the DVB-S specification for multiple EPGs to be carried.
Les Nicol
Saturday 26 July 2008 12:37PM
Brian Understood, but one has to ask the question as to why these two non-standard epg's have a particular broadcaster acting as gatekeeper rather than the management of this aspect being undertaken by the Satellite operators, in this case ASTRA or EUTELSAT.
Briantist
Saturday 26 July 2008 3:44PM
Les Nicol: The satellite operators do not provide EPG information, they form part of the transmission multiplex on each transponder which is the responsibility of whoever it is under long-term loan to. SES Astra, for example, monitor that the satellite and transponders are operating correctly, but do not provide any services directly. Sky gave undertakings to the ITC and DTI (as they both were) to allow full and at-cost access to their EPG, so they would not lock other companies out, but they seem to have 'forgotton' that. The Freesat EPG is open and free-to-air, the Sky one is not.
Les Nicol
Sunday 27 July 2008 12:20PM
Brian--- Are the FreeSat program streams delivered to a Sky satellite uplink centre or are they handled by the BBC/ITV or perhaps BT uplink centres.
Briantist
Sunday 27 July 2008 12:45PM
Les Nicol: It depends on the transponder owner. The BBC and ITV certainly don't (they use BT's Madley Earthstation and London Teleport etc) and it is Aquiva who are the other main uplinker. I think that there must be some free channels on Sky owned (well, rented) transponders that get uplinked from Southampton. It is a "free market" and there are many players!
Les Nicol
Sunday 27 July 2008 12:51PM
Brian---Thanks for that infgo. Aern't Aquiva involved in FreeSats EPG or have I got that wrong?
Briantist
Sunday 27 July 2008 1:12PM
Les Nicol: Yes, Arqiva are the main subcontractor to Freesat.
Les Nicol
Sunday 27 July 2008 5:13PM
Brian --- New players in the receiver market about to launch----METRONIC Spec---- composite and RGB enabled with twin scart. and spdif. Full HD reported at 1980 x 1080 equating to Super High Vision (SHV) also from the same stable New DTR for Release mid January 20009. Again seems a completely new and unknown player other than producing IT components eg: budget lower end computer mainboards.
Les Nicol
Sunday 27 July 2008 5:41PM
Brian--- addendum to last post---Metronic Malaysian manufacturer producing lower end Sat Receivers. Also produce Freeview Satanta Box.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Sunday 27 July 2008 8:56PM
Hi, Metronic make recievers suitable for a german pay tv package if i remember right they also make/sell the the freeview scart recievers marketed in the uk under various other names. they also make a satellite version but its quite rare in the uk, so not totally unknown to those in the trade !, It was the same with humax at first they were only known to motorised sat fitters & a few other hobbiests, but look at them now ! Mark Aberfan Aerials
Jordy
Sunday 27 July 2008 9:15PM
Mark Aberfan/ Brian- Have you seen the new nokia n96, its supposed tp have a dtt receiver and a pvr capable of 40 hours of storage. Some leap forward for a phone, know what my next phone is going to be. Wonder how good it would be at checking the output of tx's...
Les Nicol
Monday 28 July 2008 12:58PM
Brian /Mark ---Should have stated the Metronic is a "FreeSat" box (I assume you would have realized this) Release is mid October and DTR (haven't got the specs of this as yet) as stated.
Briantist
Monday 28 July 2008 2:15PM
Jordy: The Nokia N96 is a DVB-H phone and will, therefore be useless in the UK as we have no DVB-H network.
Briantist
Monday 28 July 2008 2:22PM Basingstoke
Les Nicol: Yes, there will be a second wave of Freesat boxes very soon.
Les Nicol
Tuesday 29 July 2008 11:15AM
Brian--- Is there any likelihood of the BBC World News Channel currently outputting on Eutelsat's Hotbird at 13degrees East and others; or is this a NO NO by virtue of the fact that this channel is operated by the BBC's commercial wing and has ads. Secondly out of interest does Sky have the same "Gatekeeping"/"Monopoly" in respect of Eutelsats' Eurobird Hotbird and others or is this something that is specific to Astra's group of satellites at 28degrees East or does this also include the others at 19degrees East.
Briantist
Tuesday 29 July 2008 12:05PM
Les Nicol: BBC World News carries adverts and is therefore banned from the UK. Sky has the 'gatekeeper' status on all transponders that its EPG is carried on, which includes the Hotbird satellite as well.
Les Nicol
Tuesday 29 July 2008 12:34PM
Brian Thanks for that. Sky's EPG on HOTBIRD I presume is linked to there Italian Sky services/channels of which there appear to be many. It is likely my limited knowledge in this area that makes me wonder why FreeSat with a non standard DVB-S EPG couldn't have been set up on another transponder not carrying Sky's EPG.
Briantist
Tuesday 29 July 2008 1:32PM
Les Nicol: UK channels are on Eurobird 1 at 28.5°E, a Eutelsat satellite. The Eutelsat Hotbirds (6, 7A and 8) are in a different orbital position, they have no relationship to Sky UK. The EPG information has be carried on all transponders otherwise you would only have access to the EPG whilst tuned to that transponder. The Freesat EPG IS standard, it is the Sky one that isn't.
KENNETH
Thursday 31 July 2008 4:34PM
kenneth.
Ihave a 15inh tv, a video player, and a free sat box SD, If I connect he scart cable, from the sd box to the tv, I only have one scart connection on the tv, and the 2nd scart from the sd box, to the video player,the video will not function, I THEN PURCHASED A TWIN SCART CONNECTION BOX,RESULT THEVIDEO PLAYER WORKED BUT ALAS NO FREESAT TV PICTURE, CAN YOU HELP
Briantist
Thursday 31 July 2008 4:46PM
KENNETH: Use one SCART from the Freesat box port marked "TV" and then use another from the Freesat's SCART marked VCR to the VCR. Put the satellite box into standby to see the VCR. Nothing else is needed.
Les Nicol
Saturday 9 August 2008 7:34PM
Brian and anyone interested. ---- Sky Sports 1, 2, 3 and Skybet are being received unscrambled on my Manhattan FTA. These channels are listed twice on my EPG on this receiver and the other listings remain scrambled as they are on SKY boxes.(Checked this out with a friend with a SKY box) Not sure if this is a fault with SKY's encryption or not. Some Freesat boxes appear to be getting these as well but SKY sports isn't scanning into the Humax in STB mode.
Briantist
Saturday 9 August 2008 8:44PM
Les Nicol: I can't see that lasting very long. Thanks for the info, I'm not with my Freesat box right now so I can't test it out.
Les Nicol
Saturday 9 August 2008 9:17PM
Brian -- appears that others with the Humax on the "oin freesat" blog are able to receive and others not. I was certainly able to get the Golf Cricket and Arsenal match without any problem.
Briantist
Saturday 9 August 2008 10:33PM
Les Nicol: I can't see that lasting very long. Sky are actually breaking their own agreements doing this!



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