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Freesat reception - all about dishes

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compared with terrestrial (aerial) reception.

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compa
Published on by on UK Free TV

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compare with terrestrial (aerial) reception.

By using much higher frequencies (gigahertz, compared to terrestrial televisions megahertz) more transmission channels called transponders (the satellite equivalent of multiplexes) can be provided. For example, there are only six Freeview multiplexes, but Sky or Freesat users can access two hundred satellite transponders.

Aside from exceptional weather conditions (very heavy rain for example) digital satellite provides stable pictures and audio. Where Freeview transmitters are no more than 732 metres above sea level, the geostationary satellites used for television are 35,800,000 metres above the equator so reception is possible even where buildings, trees and hills make terrestrial reception impossible.



The downside of the transmitters being 22,300 miles up in the air is that the signals are very, very weak - so standard TV aerial is of little use. When the signals are sent to the satellites, huge dish transmitters are used to uplink the signal to the satellite. These are tens of metres from side to side, and feature an emitter that generates the signal, which is first bounced of a mirror (called a reflector) and then off the surface of the parabolic dish.



There are many satellites in the sky over the equator. Often these are in clusters over a particular position, for example there are four used for UK television are at 28.2 degrees east. There is another cluster over the 19.2 degrees east positions that are used for German television.

To receive these very weak signals from the satellite, it is necessary to use a dish for reception too. By using a reflective dish, this concentrates the signals onto a small device called a LNB. This is held in front of the dish by a metal arm.



The size of dish for reception is typically much smaller; often 60cm to 100cm in diameter, but the exact size depends upon the transmitting satellite transponder. To keep the transmission power levels down to levels that can be powered by the satellite's solar panels, each beam is focused on a particular area of the Earth's surface. If you are trying to receive the signal at the centre of this zone, a small dish is required. At the outer edges, you may need a 5 metre dish. Maps of these zones are provided by the satellite companies, and are called satellite footprints.

When the dish is installed it must be aligned carefully as the signal is very weak. The installer needs to know the inclination and the azimuth from the ground location to the satellite. If you install yourself you will find that there are markings on the dish that are used to point the dish in the correct position. It is important that the view of the satellite will not be blocked, so must take into account leaves growing on trees and potential building works.

For many people the LNB will have a single cable connected to it, however if you have Sky+ or a multi-room installation the LNB package will actually contain four receivers a quad-LNB. Unlike terrestrial television where you can split the aerial cable to feed more than one Freeview box or television set, with satelite reception you cannot. So, a Sky+ box with two receivers (so you can watch one thing and record another) has two cables connecting the box to the dish.

The cable that connects the dish to the receiver must be satellite grade cable. Whilst this looks superficially like the cable used to connect and aerial to a television, a higher grade cable is required for satellite reception.

Here is an image of a co-axial cable. This sort of cable is used to connect any type of receiving aerial to the reception equipment.



RG6, PF100 and PH100 are all types of coax cable that are suitable for the very weak signals that are received by a satellite dish. (The power is the same as you would receive from a one-bar electric heater on the moon).

The conductor in the centre passes the signals received from the dish to the set-top box. This is made from steel in RG6 cable, and from copper in the RF100 and PH100 types. This makes RG6 less suitable in the UK where rain can damage the cable.

The shielding is responsible for keeping unwanted external interference from damaging the signal. In the cheaper cable this will be a foil wrap, in better specified cables this is a braid (or mesh) of copper wires. The sheild in the RF100 covers 58% of the cable.

The non-conducting layer between the shield and the conductor is called the dielectric. This can be either a solid (RG6), foam (RF100) or air-spaced (PH100) dielectric. This makes the cables progressively more flexible (ie bendy without damage).







Your comments: most recent posts are at the bottom

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Your comments are always welcome. Please use the form below to add your thoughts or questions to this page. We will get back to you as soon as we can.

NottsUK
Monday 1 December 2008 1:07PM
Briantist: Looking at your figures again I realise that 35,800,000 metres is 35,800 Kilometres.
Briantist
Wednesday 3 December 2008 7:49AM
NottsUK: At least you didn't make the mistake I saw the other day on the BBC News site, where they had "kilograms of force" in a story - twice.
Briantist
Wednesday 3 December 2008 7:52AM
NottsUK: I used "meters" for both terrestrial and satellite transmitters to compare the numbers 732 and 35,800,000 directly...
Briantist
Wednesday 3 December 2008 7:57AM
Paul O'Neill: You do need a clear view of the satellite to get a signal from it!
Roger Fitzpatrick
Wednesday 3 December 2008 4:22PM Lowestoft
We have just bought a new Panasonic 42" Plasma TV with integrated Freesat tuner.
We have a Sky minidish with Skybox. If we connect the Skybox to the TV it works OK If we disconnect the Skybox and connect the dish cable directly to the TV and then try to configure Freesat reception we get a message that says " Can't connect to Freesat check the dish & cable"
We've exchanged the Panasonic and get the same resulton the replacement. Freesat, Comet and Panasonic all say that it should work but it doesn't. Even the Comet engineer hasn't been able to enable Freesat.
Any ideas ?
Pete
Wednesday 3 December 2008 8:08PM
Please can you tell me what i would need to receive freesat in spain, on the costa blanca, in the alicante area please??
many thansk
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Wednesday 3 December 2008 9:54PM
Hi Roger,
If the lnb on your dish is faulty on the band that the freesat epg network id & transport stream are on the panasonic may think that the dish is not connected, as the sky box uses a different epg, transport stream & network id on a different band(which may be working) the sky box will see the dish.
I cant be sure but its my best guess !
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Paul O'Neill
Wednesday 3 December 2008 10:28PM Askam-in-furness
Briantist. Having done a fair bit of research into Freesat (including the great comprehensive coverage you have on this site) I do realise the need for a clear line of sight between the dish and the satellite. My point really was that the engineer installing the dish obviously wasn't as clued up. Maybe when he returns on Friday I should suggest he looks at this site!
marc
Wednesday 3 December 2008 11:15PM
freesat on the costa blanca you will need a minimum of a 1.9m dish as it runs from the same satellite as sly does @ 28.2 and 28.5 deg .Now if i remember on a 1.9 dish in alicante you will loose itv and bbc2 and a few more around 2 or 3 every day due to your location..
Briantist
Thursday 4 December 2008 8:38AM
marc: The bigger the dish, the more stable the signal will be.
Briantist
Thursday 4 December 2008 8:40AM
Paul O'Neill: Good idea! By the way, it is always better to use a long pole from the house's eves (or in the garden) than on the chimney as they can sometimes be damaged in this way.
Keith Thacker
Thursday 4 December 2008 7:15PM Burnham-on-crouch
Brian. Brilliant site! My postcode is CM0 and said to be a good satellite reception area. Even so, might it pay me to fit a 60 cm as opposed to a 43 cm dish? Secondly, I want to be able to get all the BBC and ITV channels (incl. HD) plus Channels 4 and 5 and News 24. Which is the best satellite to point my dish towards?
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Thursday 4 December 2008 8:31PM
Hi Keith,
A 60CM solid dish (like a triax td 58) or a zone 2 sky dish are always better than a std 43cm dish, we always use larger dishes on commercial jobs & you will find most riggers have a 60cm dish at their own homes ! You should point your dish at astra 2 at 28.2"e to recieve the channels you seek.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
aerialman
Friday 5 December 2008 12:08AM
keith : he's right! I have a zone 2 dish at home
Paul O'Neill
Friday 5 December 2008 5:13PM Askam-in-furness
Briantist. I'll suggest it if he ever turns up. Today was cancelled. "The engineer had no authority to tell you when he was coming back, that's up to the office". They also used the weather as a excuse (It's been a lovely dry windless day and well above freezing...I've been gardening) then it was because it had to be a 2-man job, well, that's what they were saying until I reminded them this is a bungalow. Next Tuesday is the day to watch!
derek redfern
Friday 5 December 2008 6:17PM
roger fitzpatrick
I had the same problem went maplin bought a dual lnb plus a fixing kit if mini dish 25Mts cable run it into my sat tv works a treat keep sky as alrady fitted
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Friday 5 December 2008 11:54PM
Hi Derek, thanks for your comments, they tend to confirm my thoughts about the lnb being faulty on one band. Good thinking on keeping the sky box as you then retain access to sky3 fiver & five us.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Frank
Saturday 6 December 2008 4:13PM
I have a 70cm Metronic sat dish with Sat Receiver " Touch BOX3"on which I receive "HOT BIRD".Just purchased Panasonic Flat screen HD TV with Built in " Free Sat",I Want to receive "ASTRA 2A"28.2*E Can you sugest Type of LNB to use, & can I use my 70cm dish
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Saturday 6 December 2008 6:11PM
Hi Frank, you can use the metronic dish & lnb if you focus it on 28.2 e & lose hot bird, i dont think a dual feed arangement device is available for this dish . if you want to keep hotbird it will probably be cheaper & a lot easier to have a sky dish fitted & set to 28.2e for your freesat service.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Eric Muir
Saturday 6 December 2008 7:53PM Dumfries
if I wish to change from free Sky to freesat will my dish be pointing at the correct sat. and if so, will I need a second lnb and cable to use twin record on a Humax?
sorry if this has already been asked but I just recently found this site.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Saturday 6 December 2008 8:40PM
Hi Eric,
The dis is pointing at the right satellite (astra 28.2) if you wish to use a freesat+ to its full potential you will require a quad (or twin) lnb & a second cable run.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
tony
Monday 8 December 2008 8:14AM
i am moving into a new house with tv connections in four rooms. What equipment do i need for freeview reception,the aerial connections are all in the loft.
Briantist
Monday 8 December 2008 9:49AM
Paul O'Neill: I really hope they can turn up tomorrow!
FRANK
Monday 8 December 2008 7:43PM Chatham
Hi Mark thanks for your sugestion of using sky dish to receive " HOT BIRD" & my 70cm Metronic dish for ( ASTRA 28.2) I visited MAPLINS & was told they can order me a Bracket on which I can fit two LNB,s & use my 70cm Metrinic dish & adjust the LNB to receive HOT BIRD 13.0 & ASTRA 28.2 is it possible would like your comment please
FRANK
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Tuesday 9 December 2008 5:40PM
Hi Frank,
If a multi lnb bracket is made for your dish you will need to find out you will need to find out if it will do two satellites 15" apart (not all do !) also if the bracket gives two side feeds & not one centre & one side. if the bracket has two side feeds, i would line the dish up on the original centre feed on astra 1 @ 19.2e tighten it up & then fit the multi lnb bracket & the line up the hot bird & astra 2 lnbs, that way both feeds "see" around 45-50cm of dish, it is harder to do it this way but give better results !
Please avoid "universal type" brackets as they are often best discribed as "bits of metal" & are not very good ! however if metronic make one for their dish then it might be worth a go ! I would not undertake this sort of job without at least a sat meter that identifies the different satellites.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Briantist
Tuesday 9 December 2008 8:44PM
FRANK: You can have two dishes on your house quite legally, it might be a better (and cheaper) option.
hillman
Friday 19 December 2008 2:59PM
can anyone advise me on what is required to enable me to receive 28.2 19 and 13 sats, i have a fixed 80cm dish and a sky digibox, i live in Snowdonia and reception is sometimes bad hence the 80cm dish.

thanks
Briantist
Friday 19 December 2008 4:18PM
hillman: You need a steerable dish, and a receiver suitable to drive it and select the appropriate channels, and you may require a larger dish too.
hillman
Friday 19 December 2008 4:41PM
thanks Brianist for your reply
I was rather hoping to go down the road of multi lnb's but I dont no how i would change channels, I dont understand all the jargan as I'm new to all this, but I have put up my own dish and have a grasp of the basic's.
Disquets?/urals? all a bit much for me at this stage!!
Any help advice would be greatly received.
Thanks
hillman
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Friday 19 December 2008 4:54PM
Hi Hillman,
You could leave your sky system as it is, (a sky box is not much use for other satellites) you could then get a cheap receiver & a second dish with a 6" monoblock lnb to get 13" & 19"
Mark Aberfan Aerials
hillman
Friday 19 December 2008 5:17PM
Hi Mark
Thanks for your advice
At present I have a 43cm sky dish feeding 1 sky box, then my second dish 80cm feeding another sky box, so I could put two onto one via a quad lnb which would release the big dish for 13 and 19 via a fresh s/hand receiver,
I dont want to spend a lot in case it does'nt work, doe's this make sense or am I totally of the mark!!
thanks
hillman
hillman
Saturday 20 December 2008 6:06PM
to Mark Aberfan Aerials/Briantist
thanks for your advice, I'm now thinking of going motorised with the following items
Geotrack SG99 H to H mount
Fortec Star Lifetime Ultra receiver
My question is do you think these would do the job and also is this all thats require to get me motorised, your comments would be greatly received
thanks
hillman
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Saturday 20 December 2008 10:46PM
Hi Hillman,
Yes a quad on your sky dish will serve your skyboxes, & your 80cm should be ok for 13/19 as long as you can get a decent monoblock or dual feed bracket.
Your motorised plans seem ok but require a good amount of skill setting up or a lot of time ! please dont be tempted to waste money on a second hand receiver, new ones are so cheap its a false economy !
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Briantist
Sunday 21 December 2008 8:19AM
hillman: Please let us know how you get on.
hillman
Sunday 21 December 2008 10:27AM
Hi Brianist/Mark
thanks for your continued support, at the moment my dishes are 80mtrs away from the house so I have a long cable run, I get good results on sky incorporating an in line amp, my worry is will the disequ be able to send a signal of sufficient strenght to the motor over this distance!!
also could you recommend a receiver thats not to pricey that would be suitable.
thanks
hillman
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Sunday 21 December 2008 4:56PM
Hi Hillman,
How about this receiver www.maplin.co.uk link icon 
Maplin
from a reputable manufacturer (fortec star ) who have a uk office based in Sheffield, they should be able to tell you if it can power a motorised dish over 80m & if you need a line amp with it.
I have done much longer runs & have never used a line amp.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
hillman
Sunday 21 December 2008 8:22PM Caernarfon
Hi Mark
thanks again for your continued support, looks as if this will do the job, I'll let you know how I get on, unless I've slashed my wrist in the meantime.!!
Merry Christmas
hillman
Paul O'Neill
Sunday 21 December 2008 9:47PM Askam-in-furness
Briantist: Just to let you know, different engineer called and fitted dish to gable end no problem, without extra poles, roof mounts or anything. Signal brilliant, and we're now enjoying Freesat.
Briantist
Monday 22 December 2008 9:53AM
Paul O'Neill: That is excellent news - I hope you enjoy your Freesat Christmas!
Andrew Lees
Monday 22 December 2008 7:52PM
Hi Mark/Briantist
I have just purchased a Panasonic TV with Freesat fitted. I was advised by the seller that all I would have to do is purchase a twin LNB and connect it to my current satellite dish.
The dish that I am using with a DiSEqC 1.2 is a Metronic 80cm with a single LNB. My box is a Technomate 1500 CI
Would you please advise me what is the best LNB and cable to use so that I can continue to watch all the foreign FTA channels as well as Freesat.
Many thanks
Andy Lees
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Monday 22 December 2008 8:55PM
Hi Andrew,

A twin lnb would not be suitable with you diseqc setup which appears (from what you said ) to be pointing at different satellites with foreign channels on ! Most tv shop staff would not understand about diseqc etc . A far better option would be a second dish, A standard freesat install is all that is required. (around £80) this has the added bonus that if one system goes down you still have the other !
If you are doing the install yourself a zone 1 (43cm ) or zone 2 (60cm) sky dish will work fine, if you want something a bit better a triax td 54 with a mti lnb is a good combination, use ct100/h109/pf100 benchmarked cable & you should fine.

Mark Aberfan Aerials
Briantist
Tuesday 23 December 2008 7:30AM
Mark Aberfan Aerials: It's worth adding that UK planning laws allow more than one dish to be installed on a property - the one legacy of the BSB vs Sky spat, before they merged into BSkyB.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Tuesday 23 December 2008 8:04AM
Hi Brian,

Thats the only good thing that came out of it !

Mark Aberfan Aerials
Briantist
Tuesday 23 December 2008 8:29AM
Mark Aberfan Aerials: I'm racking my brains to think of something else.
jtw
Sunday 28 December 2008 8:36PM
Don,t know if this is the forum to ask but we have skyhd (I know, costs a fortune and is a waste of time etc etc.) As we have more money than sense would like to get ITV hd on freeseat for some of the sport. Read about a splitter for the satellite wiring. Anybody know what we need??
What I have seen is a little cheap device that takes one lead from the satellite cable after it has come into the house and forks so that two come out one to sky and another lead to freeseat box.(a little adapter in fact)This has a switch so you can choose which device receives the signal. This is near to the sky box and tv. I understand about the lnb thing but this seemed simpler even if a bit fiddly assuming you have to switch from sky to freesat.
Briantist
Sunday 28 December 2008 9:01PM
jtw: You can't split the lead from the satellite - indeed you risk damaging everything if you attempt it - but you can fit a four-output "quad LNB" to the dish and run in a cable from it for a Freesat box.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Sunday 28 December 2008 9:28PM
Hi JTW,
If you have sky hd you should already have a quad lnb, so allyou have to do is run a cable from a free output on the lnb to the freesat hd box.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
jtw
Tuesday 30 December 2008 11:38AM
Hi
Thanks for advice. Was looking for a simple free(ish) solution that does not involve me on the roof. Could I just pull out the lead from the sky hd box and stick it in the freesat box when needed. Would this hurt anything?
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Tuesday 30 December 2008 4:01PM
Hi jtw,
If you take one lead out of the skyhd box it can cause failed recordings & the box to crash (more often than normal !)
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Briantist
Tuesday 30 December 2008 4:18PM
jtw: Also, you risk damaging the box and LNB if you do not disconnect the power from the Sky+ first.
Keith
Tuesday 30 December 2008 5:26PM
I have recently purchased a Freesat HD digital box. I already have a working sky dish and cabling. When I connected the Freesat box to the existing dish the signal strength is zero. Please can anyone post a possible cause and solution to this problem?

Thanks



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