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Freesat reception - all about dishes

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compared with terrestrial (aerial) reception.

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compa
Published on by on UK Free TV

Satellite reception has both advantages and disadvantages compare with terrestrial (aerial) reception.

By using much higher frequencies (gigahertz, compared to terrestrial televisions megahertz) more transmission channels called transponders (the satellite equivalent of multiplexes) can be provided. For example, there are only six Freeview multiplexes, but Sky or Freesat users can access two hundred satellite transponders.

Aside from exceptional weather conditions (very heavy rain for example) digital satellite provides stable pictures and audio. Where Freeview transmitters are no more than 732 metres above sea level, the geostationary satellites used for television are 35,800,000 metres above the equator so reception is possible even where buildings, trees and hills make terrestrial reception impossible.



The downside of the transmitters being 22,300 miles up in the air is that the signals are very, very weak - so standard TV aerial is of little use. When the signals are sent to the satellites, huge dish transmitters are used to uplink the signal to the satellite. These are tens of metres from side to side, and feature an emitter that generates the signal, which is first bounced of a mirror (called a reflector) and then off the surface of the parabolic dish.



There are many satellites in the sky over the equator. Often these are in clusters over a particular position, for example there are four used for UK television are at 28.2 degrees east. There is another cluster over the 19.2 degrees east positions that are used for German television.

To receive these very weak signals from the satellite, it is necessary to use a dish for reception too. By using a reflective dish, this concentrates the signals onto a small device called a LNB. This is held in front of the dish by a metal arm.



The size of dish for reception is typically much smaller; often 60cm to 100cm in diameter, but the exact size depends upon the transmitting satellite transponder. To keep the transmission power levels down to levels that can be powered by the satellite's solar panels, each beam is focused on a particular area of the Earth's surface. If you are trying to receive the signal at the centre of this zone, a small dish is required. At the outer edges, you may need a 5 metre dish. Maps of these zones are provided by the satellite companies, and are called satellite footprints.

When the dish is installed it must be aligned carefully as the signal is very weak. The installer needs to know the inclination and the azimuth from the ground location to the satellite. If you install yourself you will find that there are markings on the dish that are used to point the dish in the correct position. It is important that the view of the satellite will not be blocked, so must take into account leaves growing on trees and potential building works.

For many people the LNB will have a single cable connected to it, however if you have Sky+ or a multi-room installation the LNB package will actually contain four receivers a quad-LNB. Unlike terrestrial television where you can split the aerial cable to feed more than one Freeview box or television set, with satelite reception you cannot. So, a Sky+ box with two receivers (so you can watch one thing and record another) has two cables connecting the box to the dish.

The cable that connects the dish to the receiver must be satellite grade cable. Whilst this looks superficially like the cable used to connect and aerial to a television, a higher grade cable is required for satellite reception.

Here is an image of a co-axial cable. This sort of cable is used to connect any type of receiving aerial to the reception equipment.



RG6, PF100 and PH100 are all types of coax cable that are suitable for the very weak signals that are received by a satellite dish. (The power is the same as you would receive from a one-bar electric heater on the moon).

The conductor in the centre passes the signals received from the dish to the set-top box. This is made from steel in RG6 cable, and from copper in the RF100 and PH100 types. This makes RG6 less suitable in the UK where rain can damage the cable.

The shielding is responsible for keeping unwanted external interference from damaging the signal. In the cheaper cable this will be a foil wrap, in better specified cables this is a braid (or mesh) of copper wires. The sheild in the RF100 covers 58% of the cable.

The non-conducting layer between the shield and the conductor is called the dielectric. This can be either a solid (RG6), foam (RF100) or air-spaced (PH100) dielectric. This makes the cables progressively more flexible (ie bendy without damage).







Your comments: most recent posts are at the bottom

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Your comments are always welcome. Please use the form below to add your thoughts or questions to this page. We will get back to you as soon as we can.

k.hammond
Sunday 24 April 2011 11:04AM
i have panasonic freesat t.v which was working fine of old sky sat dish then came up no signal. think sat dish might of ad its day i installed a new one but unfortunately that didnt help. so i found my old sky box plugged it in and it picks up 99% of freesat channels of my new dish. so is freesat broke on my t.v or do i get sat man to come look at sat dish.
Briantist
Sunday 24 April 2011 1:09PM
k.hammond: It does rather sound like a problem with the set.
Mark
Friday 6 May 2011 8:44PM
have a sky dish which works fine for free sky channels on old sky box. Considering Freesat+ HD recorder. Will this work with existing dish
Briantist
Friday 6 May 2011 10:43PM
Mark: Yes, but you will have to fit a quad-LNB to provide you with more than one output, and another cable.
john large
Saturday 7 May 2011 2:34PM
hi have just got freesatkit with hd for home
i would like to get aportable dish for the caravan and take the hd box with me do i need a hd dish also the size of a dish for uk use
Briantist
Saturday 7 May 2011 8:09PM
john large: No special dish is required for HD channels.
Mark Aberfan Aerials
Saturday 7 May 2011 8:16PM
Hi John Large,

This is the sort of thing you need,

Sky/Freesat mini satellite dish kit for caravan camping | eBay


Mark Aberfan Aerials
Moray Christie
Monday 9 May 2011 8:22PM
Hi can you help me I live in a caravan with a sat dish,all works well,but I dont get channel 5.can you help please.
Moray
Keith Thacker
Tuesday 10 May 2011 6:36PM
In January, Les Nichol and jb38 kindly helped me to get my Humax Foxsat-HDR into service. It has worked very well until yesterday. It now shows a “green screen” on every channel.
When I switch on the Humax, I select the appropriate TV channel and the “Boot” message appears, as normal, on the Humax display. The “Humax” screen appears on the TV, as normal, and the last-viewed channel appears on the screen, with sound, for about 8-10 seconds. Then the screen goes bright green and the sound continues (for about 10 seconds). I can change channels with the remote, they appear in the HDR display, I can hear the audio (for 10 seconds) but the screen remains green. If I select “menu” or “guide” or “media”, they appear in the Humax display but the screen remains green. I have re-booted endless times with the same result. The TV (a Sony Bravia) is working perfectly and I can play DVDs with no problem. I have checked and re-checked all the internal connections and they are fine. My satellite dish has not been disturbed in any way and all the external connections are fine. My system shows that I am using Ver. U7.52.
Humax have suggested using the V-Format Button on the remote to switch between the different resolutions on the Humax box or, if this didn’t work, fully booting the Humax before switching on the TV. Neither solution has worked.
Can you please offer some advice. Also, do you know what causes the green screen?
Regards, Keith
Jim F.
Tuesday 10 May 2011 7:26PM
Keith,
I've seen the "green screen" effect before with dodgy HDMI connections. You don't say if you're using an HDMI lead (but with an HDR box I guess you are). Could be a dodgy HDMI lead (or possibly something amiss with the HDMI sockets either end).
It would be worth removing the HDMI lead and seeing if works via a SCART lead - after that you'll need to experiment with different HDMI leads, and have a close look at the sockets on the Humax and the TV.
Les Nicol
Tuesday 10 May 2011 8:36PM
Keith - The Green screen is a failure in the HDMI Handshake process between the HDR or other linked HDNI connected device. It can be triggered by changing the V format - so if you use 720p push it until it's 720p again and it will force the receiver to check that your TV complies with the HDMI connection. I experienced something similer when I connected my Hyundi Mini media centre with a "Technisat" receiver and linked to the second HDMI on the TV and booting the Hyundi first. By booting it last this corrected the handshaking process and resolved the Green Screen issue.
Briantist
Wednesday 11 May 2011 5:35PM
Keith Thacker: A "green screen" when using an HDMI link usually indicates that there is failure of the copy protection system.
Keith Thacker
Wednesday 11 May 2011 7:07PM
Many thanks to Briantist, Les and Jim F for offering, as always, solid expert advice. I checked all the sockets on the TV and Humax (they look fine - no obvious damage or distortion) and tried a different HDMI cable, rebooted the Humax but again got the green screen within 10 seconds. I also again tried the "forcing" suggestion using the Humax V-Format button but could not persuade the Humax and TV to talk to each other. I then tried using a SCART lead as suggested by Jim F and it works! All of which suggests that it is an HDMI problem. Could you guys please explain what, if anything, I am losing by using a SCART connection instead of HDMI and would Briantist kindly explain what he means by a "failure of the copy protection system". Is that now thought likely and, if so, would I have to send the unit back to Humax? Sincere thanks, again. Keith
Briantist
Wednesday 11 May 2011 7:11PM
Keith Thacker: The HDMI connection uses "HDCP" to prevent devices from recording the HD content when the source device says so.

Not all display devices support HDCP - almost all do but some very old HD equipment doesn't.

The best thing to do is to plug the TV into something else that provides an HDMI output (a PC, a DVD player etc) and confirm that the HDMI input is OK.

It *could* be a fault with the Humax - can you plug it into another HD display using an HDMI cable to confirm?
Dave Dearman
Sunday 15 May 2011 10:16AM Alexandria
Hi i have a easyfind system with a 40 cm dish in ma caravan and i am going to scotland balloch g83 8qp will i get a signal or need a bigger dish ie 54 or 60cm
Briantist
Sunday 15 May 2011 5:00PM
Dave Dearman: Unless you go to the north of Scotland, a "normal" size dish should provide reception.
simon
Monday 16 May 2011 4:25PM
hi all
just bought my self a freesat humax box HD.
i have up an old sky digital dish up and must be one of the early one and not been used for must be 4/5 years .
will the lnb work ok with the new humax HD box or will i have to get a new one for freesat HD ?
thanks
simon
Briantist
Monday 16 May 2011 5:24PM
simon: LNBs are "universal", there are no special types for HD.
Capt.Sensible
Monday 16 May 2011 7:28PM
I have a Panasonic TXL32D28 Freesat and Freeview TV. Until recently the freesat has been working perfectly since I purchased the set in March 2011. I am using an existing sky dish left by the previous owner.
Over the last two weeks the TV has increasingly started to pixelate and eventually a "no signal" message shows. I have tried replacing the wire from the LNB to the set and have the same problem. The dish seems secure and there is no visible damage. Can anyone suggest a solution?
Harry
Monday 16 May 2011 7:32PM Oldham
Capt.Sensible
It is likely to be the freesat box however it is more likely to be the dish alignment.
Anne MacDonald
Monday 16 May 2011 8:21PM
I've started losing channels on my freesat box, I only get a fraction of the free channels. Recently my signal has deteriorated, really bad interferene and channels randomly disappearing. I cannot pick up any freeview signal at all through my LCD tv with freeview built in.
jb38
Monday 16 May 2011 9:13PM
Dave Dearman: Just as an addition to what Briantist has mentioned insomuch that although a 40cm will still work in Central Scottish areas it should be pointed out that Sky generally uses 54cm dishes North of the Border, this because they provide just that little bit better performance as far as maintaining a stable picture in moderately heavy cloud conditions are concerned.

(Plus of course they are less critical in setting up!).
Briantist
Tuesday 17 May 2011 8:33AM
Anne MacDonald: This may be down to the dish having been slightly moved, or it could be down to a failure of the LNB, the device on the end of the arm of the dish.
Mike S
Tuesday 17 May 2011 1:37PM
Hi, I have a 60cm dish pointing to Astra 28.2 freesat with quad LNB, I have Three recievers (foxsat and two technomates), all of them get a strong signal from 28.2 and also a strong signal from Astra 19.2, but only on certain transponders (the ones that get the UK channels). I was hoping to get some german channels. Am I doing somethign wrong or is it that I would need to point directly to 19.2 and then loose the freesat channels

thanks
Briantist
Tuesday 17 May 2011 4:44PM
Mike S: You won't get channels from Astra 1 (19.2) unless your dish is pointing at those satellites.

The satellites use the same frequencies, so I expect you are confusing yourself by thinking the channels are coming from Astra 1.
Chris
Tuesday 17 May 2011 5:58PM
Moray Christie - what decoder are you using ?
Peter
Saturday 21 May 2011 10:36AM
I have had freesat for about 4 years but recently bought two new LED televisions for kitchen and bedroom. I then noticed the picture and sound jumping or skipping frames occasionally. The TV's appear to be working fine and don't do it when I watch a DVD. Could my LNB be failing?
Briantist
Saturday 21 May 2011 10:57AM
Peter: Yes, that could certainly be the case, or possibly there is something coming between the dish and the satellite (depending on where you have mounted it).
Dennis the Menace
Thursday 26 May 2011 9:53PM
Trouble with sagemcom dtr 94320 freesat recorder not responding to record button on remote either directly or via epg green button on display blinks all other functions seem ok including reception. I have just read a review of recording facility freezing on same model and sagemcom has told them it must be their LNBs is this possible or is it internals in box?
Briantist
Thursday 26 May 2011 10:09PM
Dennis the Menace: You might like to try, with the power off, swapping over the two satellite inputs.
lucilou
Wednesday 1 June 2011 9:08PM
I've got a Panasonic viera freesat I know I have to run cable from sky dish bit all I have on the back of tv is a normal aerial connection which I'd use to plug in a normal aerial. All I can think is to connect a normal aerial connecter to plug into tv & connect other end into sky dish, is this right? if not can anyone help please
Briantist
Thursday 2 June 2011 8:18AM
lucilou: No, you can't connect your dish to a "normal aerial connection", only to the satellite connection.

If you have a Freesat TV then there will be a satellite input connector on the back.
Alan
Monday 6 June 2011 3:40PM
Just got myself a Humax Freesat as I’m fed up with sky! The signal strength on the Humax shows only about 50%... I use to get pixilation on most sky channels so I was wondering... would it help if I fitted a decent LNB. Any comments would be welcome
Thanks
Briantist
Monday 6 June 2011 4:38PM
Alan: It is more likely that your dish is not 100% aligned with the satellite, you should check that first as a new LNB won't help if the alignment is off.
Alan
Tuesday 7 June 2011 3:57PM Mountain Ash
Thanks for the prompt reply!
I'll get myself a meter and check the dish, I will leave feedback when it's done.
Thank you.
Dennis the Menace
Tuesday 7 June 2011 4:32PM
Dennis the menace back online sorry for not replying sooner sagemcom 94320 recording functions freezing and not responding to handset. Tryed your little tip and it seemed to work ok first few tries then froze again message came up hard drive having trouble so fomat the hard disk this i did which did not seem to solve it fully i have since found out if i turn power off for a few seconds and back on again that works for so long any ideas?
James
Wednesday 8 June 2011 8:51PM
I have a Panasonic TV with Freesat. All of a sudden the HD channels (BBC) show as 'no signal' but all the rest are still ok.
Any ideas?
Thanks!
John Bull
Wednesday 8 June 2011 10:12PM
The answer is here:

Changes To BBC HD Channels On Freesat | Join Freesat

The BBC changed the transmission method without telling anyone. A brief alert at the end of a few news bulletins instead of one of the incessant previews might have been helpful.
Martin
Thursday 9 June 2011 12:40PM
Hello, I am new to using satelite TV so I was very pleased when I installed my SD Ross system in Bantry southern Ireland, the problem I now have is that the picture keeps jumping and freezing on all channels except Sky News and BBC news 24. My signal strength is 85% and signal quality is 57 to 60%, this is happening intermitently, giving a perfect picture for hours that suddenly breaks up and won't work for hours, I have adjusted the dish three times now and am sure its not that, any ideas? Ross say use the factory re-set or return the receiver and LNB but I don't want to do that if its a simple adjustment thats needed, Martin
Terry Mahon
Sunday 12 June 2011 9:52PM
Martin:
One suggestion for getting a better quality signal is check the polarity of the LNB. Don't forget the signals from Astra do not come at you true vertical & horizontal.
You may have it slightly alligned wrong.
You may have to upgrade the dish to next size
Mick
Sunday 12 June 2011 11:44PM
Using a standard Sky mini-dish with a quad LNB, in the Greater London area with uninterupted site-lines to 28deg East, what signal strength and quality would one typically expect to see on the Sky+ Box signal test page?

Mine is all over the place at times but generally about 60% on strength & 50%-60% on quality - although generally LNB 2 is slightly lower than LNB 1. Over the past couple of evenings there have been momentary signal outages but there have been heavy rain showers
Tim Evans
Thursday 16 June 2011 4:26PM
My portable dish set up has suddenly developed a fault. When aligned and receving a strong and good quality signal according to the freesat software programs are not available and show a 'no signal' advice.
brian kirke
Monday 20 June 2011 8:50PM
my humax freesat box has 2 inlet ports but my ex sky dish has only one outlet port, can i use a coaxial cable splitter instead of laying out the cost for a dual outlet LNB for the dish?.and is there any limit to the distance the splitter is from the freesat box?b ecause i want to eliminate the ammount of coaxial cable in the room.
Ron Wagg
Tuesday 21 June 2011 8:57AM
I have a Humax Freesat box and recently my reception has suffered from a line scrolling up my screen and occasionally the picture pixilates and I get the, "weak or no signal" message.
I have changed my LNB but still have the same problem.
I am running two TV sets from the same Freesat box, so it isn't a problem with the set
Mike Dimmick
Tuesday 21 June 2011 4:30PM
Ron Wagg: Check the power supplies for all equipment in the vicinity and ensure that power cables are kept well away from the signal cables.

The scrolling line is likely to be interference from the near-50Hz power on the near-50Hz SCART connection from the box to the TV. If both were exactly the same frequency the line would be static, in the same place all the time.

The intermittent interference is more likely to be mobile phone interference on the satellite cable. Keep your phone well away, or replace the cables with better-screened ones. Satellite connections should always use 'satellite-grade' cable with copper braid over copper foil screening - traditional 'low-loss' coax is not up to scratch and will pick up more noise.

If that doesn't seem to help, check whether the interference is related to some motor or other electrical equipment switching on or off, for example the thermostat or central heating pump. If so, get that equipment checked.
Ken Sims
Tuesday 21 June 2011 7:08PM
The satelite dish that is on my house was already there when I moved in. There are a row of high trees immediately behind my house that were trimmed and thinned last year. My dish points through a gap in the trees.

I have used freesat trouble free for over a year, but recently, after the trees came into full leaf, I am getting intermitant freeze frame and picture loss, particularly in windy conditions. Is it likely that the trees are the cause, or should I look for something else?
Les Nicol
Friday 24 June 2011 7:12AM
Ken Sims - It may be related to the trees Ken, but it could be that your dish has moved and requires to have the signal peaked. I'm constantly seeing SKY dishes with securing bolts missing or loose allowing movement - would be helpful if you new what size your dish was? ie: mini type 43cm or standard around 60cm. You can check the signal and picture quality levels with the receiver itself normally accessed through the menu structure. If it is very low you may need to call in a rigger to re-configure your dish.
Richard
Friday 24 June 2011 7:39AM
I have purchased a portable satellite TV system for my caravan with a 78cm dish. I can pick up Astra 2 and have nearly 600 TV channels but no BBC or ITV. I live in the SW.

Can anyone suggest how can I recieve BBC/ITV Free to Air channels as well as all these foreign TV channels? Thanks.
jb38
Friday 24 June 2011 8:35AM
Richard: Are you positive that its Astra 2 you are receiving at 28.2 degrees and not Astra at 19.2, as they are only a fraction of a movement away from each other.

Try manually punching in some of the frequencies for the channels you want as seen on the link provided.

www.lyngsat.com link icon Eurobird 1 & Astra 2A/2B/2D at 28.2°E - LyngSat
Iain barker
Tuesday 28 June 2011 2:32PM
I am thinking of buying from Aldi a portable satellite kit - dish, tuner, cables - for use when caravanning in Europe. Will i be able to get freesat reception ?
Thank you
Iain
jb38
Tuesday 28 June 2011 4:36PM
Iain barker: You will be able to receive Freesat with this kit but not in the same way as does a dedicated Freesat box, as the EPG guide is only a now and next type and not the usual programme list, this making it a bit of a nightmare when searching for your usually watched favourite channels.

The other thing to remember is that the dish is only 45cm and therefore will be a bit more critical in setting up, as indeed they even are in Northern Scotland, so this will limit the reception possibilities if you stray a bit too far towards Eastern Europe, 60+cm dishes being the more usual.

Apart from these criticisms the kit is good value for money.



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